Topic: Ideas Or Advice On Your Current / Favorite SLR Camera Lens.

[Shaun Galman]

Hi all,
After a recent purchase of a new Canon 450D Digital Rebel XSi DSLR (now there's a mouthful lol) I was very disappointed with the results that the EF-S IS(Image Stabilised) 18-55mm "thrown in" lens gives. The photos are blurry and extremely soft on detail, to the point that when I take the 12.2megapixel photos in to 100% I have trouble focusing my eyes on the detail. I thought I'd share this info so as to prepare anyone that wants to go Canon to be prepared to double the new camera price to add a decent lens to your kit just in case you don't have a spare, such as a top of the line Canon, Tamron, Sigma ect. that will easily adapt.

I'll be up for any advice on lens idea's- mm. f/. and so on. I'm currently looking into a Canon 17-55 EF-S f/2.8 IS USM but I dont have any sure plans as yet? I'm still learning the SLR ropes so to speak. This lens is currently going for around $1600ish. OUCH! It's most definitely NOT CHEAP!!! lol.

I do know that an SLR is only as good as it's lens and most pro or semi-pro photographers that I have spoken to have advised me to get the best lens possible, or at least, the best I can afford. I'm disappointed with the results as the photos are requiring far too much photoshop processing to clear them up, I just have to remind myself that the new lens will make a huge difference... fingers crossed!

Other than the lens issues I'm having, the Camera itself is totally unbelievable! I have never used an SLR before but found my way around some spectacular features in mere minutes! I couldn't recommend the camera body itself more. Very easy to use, Exposure, Apature and ISO adjustments are only a one button push away which is great!

I'd love to hear what you all think about your lenses/cameras and maybe troubles that you've had in the past or are having now, much as myself.

Cheers guys,
Shauno

[Michael Bath]

Hi Shauno,

I've heard a few bad reports about the 18-55mm kit lens included with many Canon cameras though it still surprises me that the focus is that bad - perhaps you ended up with a one-off dud lens ?

You do not have to spend that much money to get a decent lens - sure those L series F2.8 lenses will give suburb results but boy are they over-priced !  Keep in mind what you want to use the camera for and you will probably conclude that a lower priced one will suit almost all your needs. Jason (Pato) recently bought a lens for his Canon DSLR camera so no doubt he will reply with what he bought - but it cost about 1/4 of that $1600.

The Nikkor 18-70mm (f3.5-f4.5) kit lens that came with my Nikon D70 has been great and I was never disappointed with it - only that it lacked extra zoom. So I now use a Nikkor 18-200mm VR (same as IS) most of the time.

I would suggest you look for a lens with a zoom of 18mm to 85mm or more - that will suit most weather scenarios.

[Shaun Galman]

Thanks very much Michael! :D

That is certainly the information I'm after!

I'm sure this thread will get tonnes of use over time! I look forward to reading and learning greatly from everyone's input! I'm certain there will be some handy notes particularly when the time arrives for the nighttime lightning work as you say.

I guess we should still have a good month or so before anything seriously photogenic arrives in the way of lightning? September seems to be the storm season start time for us here, going by previous yearly photo accounts, so I still have time to absorb some knowledge and try to save some funds lol.

I should add a shot that best demonstrates my focus problems and show you what I'm dealing with at the moment.

Cheers,
Shauno

 

[Jason(pato)]

Hi Shauno,

As MB mentioned I recently upgraded my Canon 18-55mm kit lens to a Canon 17-85mm IS USM lens. In reality it still is a kit lens (as it comes on the 40D in most cases) but it is certainly a good upgrade. I payed around $400 off ebay (second hand) but you can pick them up for around the $500 mark new (from overseas HK). I'm pretty happy with the results so far, as it allows for a wider range of view with the extra zoom as well. It also has an infinity setting which didn't come on my 18-55mm kit lens. The real test will come in the storm season when I give it more use. I also acquired a 50mm f1.8 MK 11 lens (thanks Roddy) which produces remarkably sharp images considering its low cost. Think you can pick these up for around the $100-150 off the net. The bonus of this lens is it is ideal for lowlight conditions and great for distant lightning. If weather images (ie lightning/storm structure) is mostly what you're taking pictures of then a wide angle lens would be your best bet. I guess it all comes down to what you're willing to spend. Sure you can spend a $1000 plus on a L series lens but in the end, in my opinion, you can still capture great images with something that costs a lot less. Its all in the eye of the beholder so to speak. Your best bet would be to identify which lens will best suit your purposes, then find some reviews on the net ( dpreview is a good site) and go from there. Roddy is another person who may have some input into this topic, I know I certainly bounced my thoughts off him and MB. Good luck mate I hope you find what your looking for!

Cheers Jason

[enak_12]

Hi Shauno

Last monday I bought a new Canon 40D, upgraded from the 350D after that got ruined by salt water. I have the 18-55IS and non IS version from the 350D. My plan from the start 2 years ago was always to upgrade the lens but I had to save for a car etc anyway I learned to work with the limitations of those lenses. I found the sharpness improves a lot stoping the lens down to f8 which is fine for landscapes and in low light you can up the ISO a bit and use a tripod to keep the lens at around this aperture..I still plan on upgrading when I can, probably to the 17-40 F4 L or the Tamron 17-50 2.8 both are meant to be very sharp and much cheaper the the EFS 17-55 2.8. You might want to have a look at those.

I would also highly recommend the online store d-d-photographics.c0m. As I said I ordered the 40D on monday afternoon and got the delivery the next day at 11:00am! awesome turn around, cheap to.
(im in no way affiliated with them btw lol)

They have the 17-40 L for $860 and the 17-55 2.8 for $1229 atm and the Tamron 17-50 for $459

[Shaun Galman]

Jason(pato) & enak_12

Thanks enormously for your thoughts and suggestions! I will definitely check the lenses/sites out that you offered. I know of one or two sites but it's great to have a decent choice.

I do know I'm being lead in the right directions here so words can't express how grateful I'am to have these forums and contributors readily available! It would be a costly nightmare to say the least, if I were going this alone without advice lol!

I know all too well how unbelievable some of the photography is that's posted here by you guys (and others such as Mike, Rodney W, Jimmy and the David's just to name a few) using your DSLR's! :D

Keep on throwing any thoughts or ideas this way if you can think of anything else!
Cheers and kindest regards,
Shauno
 

[Rodney Wallbridge]

Gyday Shaun, I echo Enaks thoughts on the F8 test with and without IS switched on.Sometimes in certain circumstances the lens might need to focus on a middle ground feature and may not have focused properly on a landscape. Try taking a 50/50 ground sky picture and then take one 70/30 ground /sky.The F8 test should show if there is an aperture blade problem or a glass issue.Also worth mentioning if you have any sort of filter on the front of the Lens just remove it and try with and without.It has been noted in other forums that sometimes a Filter will give a camera focusing issues.
I have both the 17-40L and the 24-70L Lens here and is delighted with the results from both. I'd seriously look at the 17-40L, just a bit more then the Kit Lens variants if you wanted to start in an L.Yes I thought your 450d was a great buy when i saw you last weekend and welcome you to the Canon Bro Clan.

PS Finally washed the TON of Collarenebri mud off the Rav4 yesterday.

[James]

I'm also a big fan of the 17-40L lens. Used it on my 400D for the last 12 months with great results. Certainly one of the cheaper L lenses going around but still with amazing results and the weatherproofing most normal lenses don't offer. You can pick one up brand new for around $800 or second hand on ebay for around $600.

My portrait and low light lens choice is similar to a couple of others above - a Canon EF 50mm 1.4 lens. Some mind blowing photos from this lens in terms of sharpness and colour. The 1.4 aperture is amazing in low light turning a dimly lit room into a clear crisp photo. Prime lenses seem to perform better than zoom lenses however zoom's are not that far behind and provide far greater flexibility.

The kit lens I got with my newest camera is a Canon 24-105 L IS lens and boy are the results impressive! I'm using it on a full frame sensor camera and finding it a perfect fit for weather and travel photography.

Not sure if you have forked out the big $ Canon want for their accessories however if you haven't yet then don't. You will want a remote shutter release for lightning photos. I picked one up off ebay a few months back for around $6 and it works perfectly. Wasn't going to spend the $50 or so Canon wanted. Same goes with batteries.

Another vote for D D photographics here too. Excellent pricing and quick service. Plus they give you a Australian tax invoice even though they are importing stock from overseas. Nice GST tax refund!

[Shaun Galman]

Rodney W. and James
Thanks very much for your handy ideas!

Rodney- I will go out this afternoon and try the non IS <no doubt I'll need my tripod for this, 50/50 and 70/30 sky-ground split at f/8, I'll also remove the UV filter that is attached and see if I can work out whats going wrong.

I've spent more time than I care to remember cleaning that pesky dry, hardened black mud from vehicles! You'd have no hope if it was still wet lol! Just thank yourself lucky you didn't go through what we did in 1999 by bogging a fully loaded 16tonne tip truck 3feet deep and up to the tray in the mud, way out in the middle of nowhere! And yes, we got it out using our shirts to carry dry opal dirt from old 9inch auger prospect holes that were scattered hundreds of metres away from us to line the base of the deep tracks, also we stripped bark from large box eucalyptus trees to line the sides of the tracks to prevent the truck from going sideways and deeper into trouble. We almost burnt the clutch out lol, but eventually got it to reverse out of trouble. So I can tell you all to NEVER panic if your car/4wd gets bogged because no matter how bad it is just stay calm and think what myself and John (my mining partner at the time) did to ourselves out of major trouble with absolutely no tools, shovel or jacks at hand! We managed to recover the truck in only an hour or so, I should add, not a bad effort all round!

Thanks for the welcome into the CBC! I hope I can make the "Canon Brothers Clan" alumni proud this season! :D

James- Luckily I haven't spent any big $ on Canon accessories as yet. I have only got the usual "free" accessories, camera bag (in handy backpack form), two UV filters, cleaning products and a 75-300mm f/4-5.6 telephoto lens, ect.
I will look into the 50mm f/1.4 prime lens also, sounds interesting as it's sharpness and great colour reproduction is what I'd be after (my old Nikon was very good in those areas) d-d-photographics does have a great choice of lenses that I have been looking at!

I don't think I'll really need much more than 55-70mm on the zoom side as I like the current full 18mm range aspect size result from my "blurry 'ol" 18-55mm. I'm just getting used to the 6x4 aspect. It's new to me but I do like this alot. The Nikon was a 6x4.5 aspect and very difficult to print in standard sizes without cropping?   

I have also noticed my shots are coming in at 72dpi is this normal with Canon's? The Nikon was 300dpi so, just a thought I wondered about?
I guess I should post a few shots that I dramatically "saved" with some major sharpening! I hope they make the CBCA grade! :D

Cheers and take care guys, your info is always astounding!
Shauno

(I'd like to send you all a postcard in appreciation, done by Datazoid (Russ) and myself! Just PM me with a postal address and name! MB, Roddy W. and Mike (in Darwin) have all received copies of them so far)

[Adrian]

Hi Shaun,

I have been using canon gear for quite a while and will probably just repeat many of the things already mentioned, but here goes.

I can't speak for the 18-55mm lens as i have never owned or used one but offer the following thoughts:

(a) L series glass is the way to go with Canon, if your budget can afford it!

(b) Be aware that EF-S lenses won't work on a camera with a full frame sensor ... so I would generally stick with EF only lenses, as you might want to upgrade one day to a 5D or the 1ds mkIII, however this comes at the cost of approx 1.6 times focal length.

(c) only buy top grade filters Uv or other.... (High End Hoya) is a good place to start - it is pointless buying a fantastic piece of glass and having a cheap filter.

(d) when you use a tripod, turn any image stab. features off, IS etc., as this only upsets things & use a cable release. (I generally forget to do this until, I have hammered off a heap of shots )

(e) Prime lenses will give the best quality e.g 50mm but the least flexibility so depending on what you shoot, I would consider this type of lens very carefully, unless you like changing lenses a lot.

As with regards to your softness in the photos, I would start by looking into this 72dpi business, as while i don't know the camera this is obviously a setting gone a stray! if this is what you are actually getting.

You mention that you have a 75-300mm are these photos soft ???? as you move through the F stops ?

Also on the glass front i can recommend the 28-135 IS USM, until recently this was my primary lens.


Hope this helps,
Cheers,
.adrian

[Shaun Galman]

Hi Adrian,
Thank you, this advice is a huge help also! I'm sure we are all learning a few new things here and there from this thread!

I have been on the Canon forums and into the lens threads. This 18-55mm of mine is a notoriously BAD kit lens apparently so I'm not too worried about it anymore (as long as it wasn't the camera!).

I will be looking into 2 lenses for the time being. Something wide angle like a 10-17mm would be great, though I will have to look into the full frame EF-S issues you advised of. I will also like to add something a little more transitional and versatile like a EF-S 24-70mm f/2.8L

My UV filter is a fairly good Hoya. It's kind of a necessity here with the very fine white silica dust from the mines around town. It is severely abrasive at times! Datazoid (Russ) uses the same (well my spare one anyway) UV lens on his Olympus E510 with no real issues that I can see? I guess it would be ok not to use it when the ground is wet but I'll leave it on while the wind is kicking up the dust, just in case

I haven't really tried my 75-300mm lens yet. I read they are not the best either lol? I wish Canon just left these out of the deal! It spoils things in a way when you see results that aren't up to scratch with what you're used to, but anyway? I look forward to getting the new lenses that's for sure!

Kindest regards,
Shauno   

[Adrian]

Hi Shaun,

No problem at all.

Just one clarification about uv filters (and the like). - I would *always* advocate the use of one....  (I only remove one to put another filter in its place)
regardless of the environment that you photograph in as they are an excellent first barrier for scratches, and knocks.

And should you drop a lens ........ as I have done only once!!!! .....  something to smash 'hopefully' before any other element(s)   

The only other comment I would make is to make sure that you either do the home work yourself or buy from someone you trust, as I can't tell you how many times I have walked into a camera store and been given the wrong information ..... particularly with regards to EF-S series lenses.

My preference is always to walk into a camera store that has a good range of products and good support staff and for me to walk away with a product and for this you pay a premium (and I don't have a problem with this line of thinking).  I do have a problem when you are paying $1000+ and you get the wrong information so now I do my own research and buy from the internet, as I live in Darwin and we are somewhat starved for choice.

Regardless of the 18-55mm being notoriously bad (as per your comments) I would be sending it back to canon and say FIX IT !!! regardless of the known problems.  If it is in fact a problem with the lens canon is certainly better than that; regardless of kit lens or not.

Anyway best of luck!

Cheers,
Adrian

[Shaun Galman]

Lens purchasing advice dually noted Adrian, thanks kindly once again! I too am stuck a fair distance from any major camera dealers so I understand where you are coming from! I also understand your woes in regards to the limited information they provide at times. Datazoid (Russ) and myself did a trip some time ago to a few camera dealers in Dubbo NSW and were stunned to find that once they realize you know more than they do, they panic and head for the internet to print off a few spec sheets lol! Most shop workers we encountered only knew how to turn the cameras on and that was the extent of their knowledge lol? Where has the old fashioned in store training gone?

I have some great news camera-wise as well! I think I may have got around the problems with my EF-S 18-55mm lens. As Rodney, et al advised I switched the Image Stabilizer off as I think it may be trying to over-correct the shot? I then threw the beast on a tripod, set manual focus and put a 2second timer on the relese. It actually took some real crisp shots in low light! [I have an amazing feature in the live view mode that lets me zoom in to 25x magnification of any point in the current view and manually focus that point] I can now see and shoot 4mm high writing pretty clearly from 5mtrs with my lens @ 24mm. I'm busting to get outside tomorrow and grab a few more landscapes that won't ruin your eyes with extreme softness!

I will post some photo results soon.
I am still trying to work out why the shots are still coming in at 72dpi when I transfer them to my pc? There are no other rez settings other than the usual small, medium, large or raw/raw large.

Cheers guys, don't forget, PM me for the free postcards on offer!
Take care,
Shauno
     

Edit: I have just found out the jpeg compression is normally set to 72dpi. This is normal for 450D's. Shooting in RAW gives 350dpi, now that's what I was after lol!

[Michael Bath]

I still don't get the use of dots-per-inch DPI properly and maybe it's less relevant with digital cameras. If you have taken a photo at 12mp or 4272 x 2848 pixels, then you have over 12 million "dots" of information. How does the DPI being 72 or 350 impact on an image that has dimensions of 4272 x 2848 ?  I don't think it does, as the DPI is an instruction for a printer to print an image at a certain size.

Over the years some people requesting images for printing are obsessed with DPI, but most are just happy to know the pixel dimensions.

My Nikon does the same - shows JPGs as 72 DPI and RAW 300 DPI.

Pixel dimensions are what matters.

Glad you are solving your lens problems Shauno

MB

[Adrian]

Hi MB,

You pose an interesting question ..... i only use RAW so have never noticed this out put in a JPG file, as i think of it as something that the 'user' sets for a device e.g a 'printer'. (as you stated)

When ever I use a lab I always provide a tiff at a print size e.g. 7"x10" and specify the dpi at either normal 250dpi or fine 400dpi.

However if you provide just the pixels you could always work backwards (to determine print size at a set dpi)

An image created at 4272 x 2848  using a DPI of 300 is approx 14" x 9.5". 

Inches = Pixels/DPI

                4272 /  300 = 14.24"

DPI is certainly important for printing .... but don't understand why one would display 72dpi when RAW is apparently 300dpi.

Question for the floor ????

Cheers,
.adrian