Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Caloundra TORNADO
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 98 00:08:22 +1000
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From: mildad 
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>I just saw a report on the Ch 10 5pm news that Caloundra was hit by a
>tornado.  There were eyewitness reports of a cone shaped cloud and branches
>swirling around in the air.  I might add the reporter or Ch 10 also said it
>was the first tornado in Qld for 25 years!!  So I guess we'll have to see
>other reports about the Caloundra tornado to back it up.  It looked like
>F2/low F3 damage.

The way our media is James look at the bright side...At least it was 
reported as a tornado and not a willy-willy, a mini-cyclone or a freak 
storm as they are down here.

Perhaps by storm chasing together we may get enough video footage to get 
Australian tornadoes the media attention they deserve.

David C

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: Re: aussie-weather: meeting venue
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 98 00:08:20 +1000
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From: mildad 
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>If Michael Scollay is able to provide such a great venue, then that is
>where it should be held: 7pm in the CBD. Both Jimmy Deguara and myself will
>certainly be able to attend.

Yes I would agree Michael it sounds like an excellent venue. I will, at 
this stage, assume that the meeting will be held at one of the... thirty 
(!) Telstra buildings in the city to be specified by Michael S. With a 
conference call facility perhaps interstate chasers could be actively 
involved in the initial organisation which would be great.

Thanks Michael for providing the venue.

David C 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1998 23:32:44 +0800
From: Ira 
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Caloundra TORNADO
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

James Chambers wrote:
> 
> Hi all
> 
> I just saw a report on the Ch 10 5pm news that Caloundra was hit by a
> tornado.  There were eyewitness reports of a cone shaped cloud and branches
> swirling around in the air.  I might add the reporter or Ch 10 also said it
> was the first tornado in Qld for 25 years!!  So I guess we'll have to see
> other reports about the Caloundra tornado to back it up.  It looked like
> F2/low F3 damage.


I did see the news report, impressive. However I must disagree with the
F-2/F-3 rating. I was'nt there of course, but from what i saw, fences
were down, some trees were damaged and there was only one house with the
roof off. This is hardley an F-2. The house was also a two story flat
roofed home, these are the weakest and eaisily damaged by wind. we had
an F-0 here in Perth in 96' that deroofed a block of flats and one home.
Remember an F-2 will permatley relocate your semi trailer. Anyway thats
just one fools opinion. i have investigated many tornado tracks over the
years and the footage i saw was didnt look like F-2/F-3 material.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "James Chambers" 
To: 
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Caloundra TORNADO
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 01:44:34 +1000
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Ira, and everyone:

I didn't say anything after I sent the email to Aussie Wx about it because I
had already sent so many emails.  You must understand my initial excitement
on hearing about the tornado - I'm not usually like that!  I still think it
may have reached a high F1.  But hey, you're the expert Ira.  I have to go
back and look at the video.  I'm surprised that was the only severe damage
report from Tuesday's storms - there must be damage out there somewhere.

>
>I did see the news report, impressive. However I must disagree with the
>F-2/F-3 rating. I was'nt there of course, but from what i saw, fences
>were down, some trees were damaged and there was only one house with the
>roof off. This is hardley an F-2. The house was also a two story flat
>roofed home, these are the weakest and eaisily damaged by wind. we had
>an F-0 here in Perth in 96' that deroofed a block of flats and one home.
>Remember an F-2 will permatley relocate your semi trailer. Anyway thats
>just one fools opinion. i have investigated many tornado tracks over the
>years and the footage i saw was didnt look like F-2/F-3 material.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 00:16:05 +0800
From: Ira 
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Bureau's Warning Service...
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Hi there everyone,
          I read with interest Pauls Grahams comments on Australia's
warning system or rather lack of. I used to think that yes we do need to
have a system in place that spells out the dangers of tornados in Aus.
Here in WA I'm in a unique situation as far as my relationship with the
weather bureau and the guys who work in the Severe Weather section. I
have become quite good freinds with them over the last three years. We
share information and I'am as invaluable to them as they are to me. I
have also grown to see a few things from their point of view. 

The three biggest reasons that they do not forecast tornaodos possible
are,

1) Lack of accuracy. The Bureau here has, and must have a policy to be
accurate. If they forecast a tornado watch everytime there is a severe
thunderstorm advice, how many times would they be right. Lets face it.
Tornaods do occur but they are very, very rare in populated areas. Over
forecasting also leads to complacency with the public. If they are
hearing these warnings all the time they will ignore them.

2) Can you imagine the 6:00pm news with a tornado watch issued. People
would freak!!

3) The simple fact that 99.9% of Australians do not even know what a
tornado really is. Let alone the fact that we do have them and they may
occur near their home! People are just not educated. As storm spotters
and chasers in this country education should be right up there with
going out on a chase. Chasing should be more than just fancy photos.
Over here I have driven 800k's return trip to map and rate a tornado
track, more than once. This is grass roots data. 
  Get involved with your buearu. Once they see that you are for real and
can be of a use to them, I'm sure they would share info. Also remember
that the bureau's hand are tied. They dont have the money or resources
to educate people. Plus for alot of them its their job, they are'nt as
passonaite about it as we are. We need to do the work, its up to us. We
need to get out in the community. 
  My interest in severe weather involves, chasing, reporting what i see
on a good chase ( particualry if a funnel cloud, or wall clouds are seen
)to the buearu, going out to map and rate tornado tracks, return to the
bureau with tihs info where we go over radar pics, wind profiles and
such of the storms, doing talks at local high schools, talks on local
radio and such. Its a whole package. We need to get out and do our bit,
there is only so much the bureau can do. No one will make it happen for
us thats for sure.
  Well hope i stirred the pot a bit,
                                        Ira Fehlberg


Paul Graham wrote:
 
 Hi everyone,
         I have been reading some of the comments about Australia's
severe storm warning service and I have to say that I think the severe
storm warning service, ...................................In the end, no
warning system can be perfect and people should not expect it to be or
blame weather forecasters for storm damage.
What do people think about these ideas?
Cheers,
         Paul G.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 00:18:37 +0800
From: Ira 
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Caloundra TORNADO
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Ira, and everyone:

I didn't say anything after I sent the email to Aussie Wx about it
because I
had already sent so many emails.  You must understand my initial
excitement
on hearing about the tornado - I'm not usually like that!  I still think
it
may have reached a high F1.  But hey, you're the expert Ira.  I have to
go
back and look at the video.  I'm surprised that was the only severe
damage
report from Tuesday's storms - there must be damage out there somewhere.



Hey, I'm no expert!!. Just thought it didnt look that strong.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Paul_Mossman at agd.nsw.gov.au
X-Lotus-Fromdomain: NSW_AG
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 08:41:16 +1000
Subject: aussie-weather: Heavy Rain & Local Flooding in Manning Valley Areas
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com



Howdy all. Good to hear bout the Tornado!! Wowsers!!

We here this morning received very heavy rain with the following falls
received between 3pm yesterday & 6am this Morning:

Rainbow Flat:       88 mms
Hillville:               54 mm
Tuncurry:      46 mm
Taree:              48 mm
Croki:              43 mm
Me:            30.4 mm :-(

There is alot of localised flooding around at the moment, with I nearly not
being able to get to work! what a shame..............................

Talk soon!

Paul.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "viking" 
To: 
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Bureau's Warning Service...
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 06:44:23 +0800
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
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Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
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Hi all,
	Nice to read a positive statement about the BOM, lets face it nobodys
perfect and yes they make mistakes,but so do we all.As I live in perth I
won`t be able to be at the meeting,(too far to travel), but I look foreward
to hearing all about it.
Anne

----------
> From: Ira 
> To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
> Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Bureau's Warning Service...
> Date: Thursday, November 26, 1998 12:16 AM
> 
> Hi there everyone,
>           I read with interest Pauls Grahams comments on Australia's
> warning system or rather lack of. I used to think that yes we do need to
> have a system in place that spells out the dangers of tornados in Aus.
> Here in WA I'm in a unique situation as far as my relationship with the
> weather bureau and the guys who work in the Severe Weather section. I
> have become quite good freinds with them over the last three years. We
> share information and I'am as invaluable to them as they are to me. I
> have also grown to see a few things from their point of view. 
> 
> The three biggest reasons that they do not forecast tornaodos possible
> are,
> 
> 1) Lack of accuracy. The Bureau here has, and must have a policy to be
> accurate. If they forecast a tornado watch everytime there is a severe
> thunderstorm advice, how many times would they be right. Lets face it.
> Tornaods do occur but they are very, very rare in populated areas. Over
> forecasting also leads to complacency with the public. If they are
> hearing these warnings all the time they will ignore them.
> 
> 2) Can you imagine the 6:00pm news with a tornado watch issued. People
> would freak!!
> 
> 3) The simple fact that 99.9% of Australians do not even know what a
> tornado really is. Let alone the fact that we do have them and they may
> occur near their home! People are just not educated. As storm spotters
> and chasers in this country education should be right up there with
> going out on a chase. Chasing should be more than just fancy photos.
> Over here I have driven 800k's return trip to map and rate a tornado
> track, more than once. This is grass roots data. 
>   Get involved with your buearu. Once they see that you are for real and
> can be of a use to them, I'm sure they would share info. Also remember
> that the bureau's hand are tied. They dont have the money or resources
> to educate people. Plus for alot of them its their job, they are'nt as
> passonaite about it as we are. We need to do the work, its up to us. We
> need to get out in the community. 
>   My interest in severe weather involves, chasing, reporting what i see
> on a good chase ( particualry if a funnel cloud, or wall clouds are seen
> )to the buearu, going out to map and rate tornado tracks, return to the
> bureau with tihs info where we go over radar pics, wind profiles and
> such of the storms, doing talks at local high schools, talks on local
> radio and such. Its a whole package. We need to get out and do our bit,
> there is only so much the bureau can do. No one will make it happen for
> us thats for sure.
>   Well hope i stirred the pot a bit,
>                                         Ira Fehlberg
> 
> 
> Paul Graham wrote:
>  
>  Hi everyone,
>          I have been reading some of the comments about Australia's
> severe storm warning service and I have to say that I think the severe
> storm warning service, ...................................In the end, no
> warning system can be perfect and people should not expect it to be or
> blame weather forecasters for storm damage.
> What do people think about these ideas?
> Cheers,
>          Paul G.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Paul_Mossman at agd.nsw.gov.au
X-Lotus-Fromdomain: NSW_AG
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 08:50:22 +1000
Subject: aussie-weather: Re: Tornado in SE QLD
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com



Howdy all. Just thought I would put a bit more in the pot to stir
things..............

If I remeber correctly, QLD has a building requirement requiring certain
"cyclone" structures does it not? So therefore, it may downplay the
strength of any severe events such as Tornados & cyclones due to
strengthened buildings...........just a thought.

Paul

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 10:10:45 +1100
From: Michael Scollay 
Organization: Telstra Strategy & Research
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To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: meeting venue
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Michael Bath wrote:
[snip]
> ...
> Michael S: if you would care to give us the address details and also of the
> nearest parking station. I think this venue should be finalised asap to
> enable intra/interstate visitors to finalise their travel plans.

Primary venue: 7/255 Elizabeth Street
Secondary venue: 4/175 Liverpool Street
These venues are within 5 minutes walk of each other.

At both venues, I will be required to give access to all visitors by
opening the door after a phone call:-) The primary venue is better
since I can inform the security guard located in the building entry in
advance to let visitors in after the doors nominally close. I will
then only have to let people into the meeting room. A start time after
18:00 is preferred.

Parking for both venues can be found on the streets nearby after 18:00
or 18:30 for free. Otherwise, State Super parking under 175 Liverpool
street with access from the rear lanes is available and a few others.
The domain parking is about 500m away.

Tuesday is a worse day for ad-hoc parking as that day is half-price
movie night in the Hoyts, Village etc. cinemas on George St. nearby.
Most patrons however use public transport.

Town Hall railway station is 5 minutes walk away. Museum Railway
station is 3 minutes walk away. Buses run down George and Elizabeth
streets but North Shore buses leave from Wynyard some 15 minutes walk
away.

Michael Scollay       mailto:michael.scollay at telstra.com.au

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Paul_Mossman at agd.nsw.gov.au
X-Lotus-Fromdomain: NSW_AG
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 09:17:09 +1000
Subject: aussie-weather: Meeting venue.
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com



I would like to put my weight behind Michael Scollays idea for the CBD
venue. Parramatta would be great, but I would have some trouble getting
back, as I will be staying in the CBD without a car.

Paul.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 10:26:00 +1100 (EST)
From: Paul Graham 
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: aussie-weather: Tornado Warnings for Australia...
Reply-Receipt: pgraham1 at extro.ucc.su.oz.au
Reply-Read: pgraham1 at mail.usyd.edu.au
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Hi Ira and everyone,
	Interestingly, there is a tornado warning product available for
the ACT (probably prompted by the Chisholm tornado) and Tasmania.  When I
was commenting about improvements that could be made to the Australian
severe storm warning service, I was thinking that this tornado warning
service could be expanded to other areas (with possibly the addition of a
"tornado watch" on days when they are likely - eg. Storm Relative
Helicity, CAPE, upper level jet etc... - and thunderstorms are starting to
develop). The main problem about warning for a tornado is that the radar
network is not very extensive at present and I am not sure whether Doppler
radar, which can be used for detecting the possibility of a tornado, is
available yet.  So as you say, Ira, it probably isn't worth it, especially
when the risk of a significant one occurring in a populated area is low.
The other point is that microbursts are most likely more common with
severe storms and can be just as destructive so why only warn for a
tornado?  The main comments I was making in regard to the Australian
warning service were about improvements that could be made to the
broadcasting of warnings to people affected as well as improvements to the
timeliness of warnings rather than about a tornado warning system as such.
As I said in the beginning, on the whole I think the service in its
current form is very good. 
	- Paul G.

----------------------------
Paul Graham
m3052695 at hardy.ocs.mq.edu.au
----------------------------

On Thu, 26 Nov 1998, Ira wrote:

> Hi there everyone,
>           I read with interest Pauls Grahams comments on Australia's
> warning system or rather lack of. I used to think that yes we do need to
> have a system in place that spells out the dangers of tornados in Aus.
> Here in WA I'm in a unique situation as far as my relationship with the
> weather bureau and the guys who work in the Severe Weather section. I
> have become quite good freinds with them over the last three years. We
> share information and I'am as invaluable to them as they are to me. I
> have also grown to see a few things from their point of view. 
> 
> The three biggest reasons that they do not forecast tornaodos possible
> are,
> 
> 1) Lack of accuracy. The Bureau here has, and must have a policy to be
> accurate. If they forecast a tornado watch everytime there is a severe
> thunderstorm advice, how many times would they be right. Lets face it.
> Tornaods do occur but they are very, very rare in populated areas. Over
> forecasting also leads to complacency with the public. If they are
> hearing these warnings all the time they will ignore them.
> 
> 2) Can you imagine the 6:00pm news with a tornado watch issued. People
> would freak!!
> 
> 3) The simple fact that 99.9% of Australians do not even know what a
> tornado really is. Let alone the fact that we do have them and they may
> occur near their home! People are just not educated. As storm spotters
> and chasers in this country education should be right up there with
> going out on a chase. Chasing should be more than just fancy photos.
> Over here I have driven 800k's return trip to map and rate a tornado
> track, more than once. This is grass roots data. 
>   Get involved with your buearu. Once they see that you are for real and
> can be of a use to them, I'm sure they would share info. Also remember
> that the bureau's hand are tied. They dont have the money or resources
> to educate people. Plus for alot of them its their job, they are'nt as
> passonaite about it as we are. We need to do the work, its up to us. We
> need to get out in the community. 
>   My interest in severe weather involves, chasing, reporting what i see
> on a good chase ( particualry if a funnel cloud, or wall clouds are seen
> )to the buearu, going out to map and rate tornado tracks, return to the
> bureau with tihs info where we go over radar pics, wind profiles and
> such of the storms, doing talks at local high schools, talks on local
> radio and such. Its a whole package. We need to get out and do our bit,
> there is only so much the bureau can do. No one will make it happen for
> us thats for sure.
>   Well hope i stirred the pot a bit,
>                                         Ira Fehlberg
> 
> 
> Paul Graham wrote:
>  
>  Hi everyone,
>          I have been reading some of the comments about Australia's
> severe storm warning service and I have to say that I think the severe
> storm warning service, ...................................In the end, no
> warning system can be perfect and people should not expect it to be or
> blame weather forecasters for storm damage.
> What do people think about these ideas?
> Cheers,

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Paul_Mossman at agd.nsw.gov.au
X-Lotus-Fromdomain: NSW_AG
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 10:51:48 +1000
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: meeting venue
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com



Thanx for the effort Michael.

So the meeting is on:

Thursday, the 3rd December 1998 at 18:30  at

7/255 Elizabeth Street SYDNEY.

A copy of the agenda has already been distributed via the Aussie weather
List.

It would be appreciated if an idea of No.s for Michael & Myself could be
forwarded to this email address asap:

Paul_Mossman at agd.nsw.gov.au

Those who cannot attend, esp due to distances etc., would you please put an
apology in, so we can idea of numbers interested.

Regards, Paul.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "James Chambers" 
To: "Aussie Weather" 
Subject: aussie-weather: SA Severe TS Advice
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 15:15:58 +1000
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PRIORITY - FOR BROADCAST AS SOON AS POSSIBLE
SEVERE THUNDERSTORM ADVICE
Bureau of Meteorology Adelaide Issued  at  3.15 pm on  Thursday, 26/11/98

For people in the Northwest Pastoral district west of Tarcoola to
Marla, and in the West Coast district.

Severe winds and large hail are possible with thunderstorms in the
above districts this afternoon and evening.

Localised damage is possible and people are advised to take
precautions, such as to secure loose outside objects and move
vehicles under cover.
------------------------------------------------------
James Chambers
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~jamestorm/bristorm.html

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Blair Trewin 
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: SA Severe TS Advice
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 16:22:48 +1100 (EST)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

> 
> PRIORITY - FOR BROADCAST AS SOON AS POSSIBLE
> SEVERE THUNDERSTORM ADVICE
> Bureau of Meteorology Adelaide Issued  at  3.15 pm on  Thursday, 26/11/98
> 
> For people in the Northwest Pastoral district west of Tarcoola to
> Marla, 
All twenty of them....

Seriously, it looks like tomorrow could be a pretty interesting
day through SA and Victoria. The fire weather estimates for 
Melbourne tomorrow have 50 km/h winds with gusts to 75, which is
higher than I can remember seeing on a forecast for a while.

Blair Trewin

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Jane ONeill" 
To: "Aussie Weather" 
Subject: aussie-weather: Interesting stuff right now
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 16:45:02 +1100
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
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Darwin is suddenly starting to look interesting.....
http://www.qantmnt.au-net.com/webcam/index.html

Check out the 3:29 image here also for the weather in the Gulf of
Carpentaria...
http://www.nt.gov.au/JCUMetSat/aushlast.gif

Melbourne presently:
Temp 30.2    DP 6.2      1Cu     NNE wind, & heading for a very dry 12 - 18
hours before the change comes through.

Jane

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 17:39:20 +1100
From: Michael Scollay 
Organization: Telstra Strategy & Research
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4m)
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To: Aussie Weather 
Subject: aussie-weather: Meeting 3/12/1998...
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Those who wish to attend in person at 7/255 Elizabeth St. on 3/12/1998
or join the meeting via phone conference commencing 18:30 are advised
of the following:

1) Doors from the Eliz. St. side automatically open until 19:00

2) Lifts have open access to the 7th floor until 19:00

3) After 19:00, wave to the security guard at the front desk. 
   He will have a list of attendees (see 4 below) then will 
   admitt them into the building and lift for access to the 
   7th floor.

4) Please Email me your name ASAP if attending in person so 
   that a list can be given to the security guard.

5) On arrival at the 7th floor, the conference room is on the 
   western side of the lift lobby through a large glass door. 
   I'm hoping to keep that open so that you can just walk in 
   and turn left directly to the room. If not, the telephone 
   number is 02 9298 5802 (x85802). If that is engaged, contact 
   my number 02 9298 5891 (x85891).

6) Let me know via Email if you want to join via a phone 
   conference. 

7) I'll try to arrange coffee/tea & biscuits.

8) Exit is at any time.

Michael Scollay       mailto:michael.scollay at telstra.com.au

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Jimmy Deguara" 
To: 
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Meeting 3/12/1998...
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 17:47:00 +1100
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Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com

Thanks for the help, Michael. This seems to be much more organised than I
thought.

Michael Bath and I will be attending unless something stops us...

Jimmy Deguara

-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Scollay 
To: Aussie Weather 
Date: Thursday, November 26, 1998 5:41 PM
Subject: aussie-weather: Meeting 3/12/1998...


>Those who wish to attend in person at 7/255 Elizabeth St. on 3/12/1998
>or join the meeting via phone conference commencing 18:30 are advised
>of the following:
>
>1) Doors from the Eliz. St. side automatically open until 19:00
>
>2) Lifts have open access to the 7th floor until 19:00
>
>3) After 19:00, wave to the security guard at the front desk.
>   He will have a list of attendees (see 4 below) then will
>   admitt them into the building and lift for access to the
>   7th floor.
>
>4) Please Email me your name ASAP if attending in person so
>   that a list can be given to the security guard.
>
>5) On arrival at the 7th floor, the conference room is on the
>   western side of the lift lobby through a large glass door.
>   I'm hoping to keep that open so that you can just walk in
>   and turn left directly to the room. If not, the telephone
>   number is 02 9298 5802 (x85802). If that is engaged, contact
>   my number 02 9298 5891 (x85891).
>
>6) Let me know via Email if you want to join via a phone
>   conference.
>
>7) I'll try to arrange coffee/tea & biscuits.
>
>8) Exit is at any time.
>
>Michael Scollay       mailto:michael.scollay at telstra.com.au

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Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 16:14:34 +0800
From: Ira 
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To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Tornado Warnings for Australia...
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Paul Graham wrote:
> 
> Hi Ira and everyone,
>         Interestingly, there is a tornado warning product available for
> the ACT (probably prompted by the Chisholm tornado) and Tasmania.  When I
> was commenting about improvements that could be made to the Australian
> severe storm warning service, I was thinking that this tornado warning
> service could be expanded to other areas (with possibly the addition of a
> "tornado watch" on days when they are likely - eg. Storm Relative
> Helicity, CAPE, upper level jet etc... - and thunderstorms are starting to
> develop). The main problem about warning for a tornado is that the radar
> network is not very extensive at present and I am not sure whether Doppler
> radar, which can be used for detecting the possibility of a tornado, is
> available yet.  So as you say, Ira, it probably isn't worth it, especially
> when the risk of a significant one occurring in a populated area is low.
> The other point is that microbursts are most likely more common with
> severe storms and can be just as destructive so why only warn for a
> tornado?  The main comments I was making in regard to the Australian
> warning service were about improvements that could be made to the
> broadcasting of warnings to people affected as well as improvements to the
> timeliness of warnings rather than about a tornado warning system as such.
> As I said in the beginning, on the whole I think the service in its
> current form is very good.


                             I agree absoulutley, Ira

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Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 16:16:11 +0800
From: Ira 
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To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aussie-weather: Re: Tornado in SE QLD
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Paul_Mossman at agd.nsw.gov.au wrote:
> 
> Howdy all. Just thought I would put a bit more in the pot to stir
> things..............
> 
> If I remeber correctly, QLD has a building requirement requiring certain
> "cyclone" structures does it not? So therefore, it may downplay the
> strength of any severe events such as Tornados & cyclones due to
> strengthened buildings...........just a thought.
> 
> Paul

True, maybe someone over there may be able to find out some more
details. Do the bureau over there even map and rate tornadoes? The house
i saw was on old two strory fibro home.

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From: "Michael Thompson" 
To: 
Subject: aussie-weather: Wide variation in Illawarra rainfall
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 19:51:54 +1100
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Some very dramatic differences from the north to the south, heavy rainfall,
even bordering on flash floods in some of Wollongongs northern suburbs this
morning, whilst the Shellharbour area had light showers that cleared
quickly.

One person even told me that they heard thunder, but I cannot confirm.

I will let you know when official figures come in.

Michael Thompson
http://thunder.simplenet.com

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From: "Michael Thompson" 
To: 
Subject: aussie-weather: Fw: Wide variation in Illawarra rainfall
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 20:00:52 +1100
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The official figures show the Wollongong got 46mm, whilst Kiama only 10mm,
the Wollongong fall looks the best outside the mid north coast, but I only
had a quick scan.

Michael



>Some very dramatic differences from the north to the south, heavy rainfall,
>even bordering on flash floods in some of Wollongongs northern suburbs this
>morning, whilst the Shellharbour area had light showers that cleared
>quickly.
>
>One person even told me that they heard thunder, but I cannot confirm.
>
>I will let you know when official figures come in.
>
>Michael Thompson
>http://thunder.simplenet.com

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Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 20:42:50 +1100 (EST)
From: Paul Graham 
To: Aussie Weather 
Subject: aussie-weather: Conference on Disaster Prevention...
Reply-Receipt: pgraham1 at extro.ucc.su.oz.au
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In November of 1999 a conference on Disaster Prevention will be held at
the National Convention Center in Canberra.  More information about this
conference is available from Emergency Management Australia:

http://www.ema.gov.au/conferencefr.htm

----------------------------
Paul Graham
m3052695 at hardy.ocs.mq.edu.au
----------------------------

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Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 21:11:05 +1100 (EST)
From: Paul Graham 
To: Aussie Weather 
Subject: aussie-weather: TV Series on Natural Hazards...
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In October, on the ABC, a TV series on Natural Hazards was screened which
included episodes on severe storms, cyclones, floods and bushfires.  The
series will be repeated from December the 14th.  Apparently the videos
will be available early next year.  More information at:

http://www.ema.gov.au/mediareleases/tvseries.htm


----------------------------
Paul Graham
m3052695 at hardy.ocs.mq.edu.au
----------------------------

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Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 21:18:47 +1100 (EST)
From: Paul Graham 
To: Aussie Weather 
Subject: aussie-weather: TV Program on the Weather
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On Saturday night in Sydney, a program on the weather (I think with an
emphasis on severe weather) will be screened on Channel 7's "The World
Around Us".

----------------------------
Paul Graham
m3052695 at hardy.ocs.mq.edu.au
----------------------------

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From: "McDonald" 
To: 
Subject: aussie-weather: TV SHOW
Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 21:21:40 +1100
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Hi all,

Thanks to those who helped me get into IRC last night.

For melbournians - if we happen to get nothing from this next cold front in
the way of storms there is a program on Saturday night called "Australia's
Natural Born Killers" on Channel Rex ( 7 ) at 6:30pm.  It may/should have
some interesting information and footage on storms/cyclones as it goes for
two hours and I don't think there is two hours of worthwile fire and
earthquake information to last that long.

Lightning tracker - I have just sent an email back to these people and will
hopefully have more soon.

Andrew McDonald.

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Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 09:23:30 +1100
From: Don White 
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Another figure from Coledale of 50.2 mm
also, heavy rain on Sydney's northern beaches on Wednesday night. mona
Vale 49.5 mm including 31 mm in the hour to 10 pm.
Regards,
don White  

Michael Thompson wrote:
> 
> The official figures show the Wollongong got 46mm, whilst Kiama only 10mm,
> the Wollongong fall looks the best outside the mid north coast, but I only
> had a quick scan.
> 
> Michael

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Date: Thu, 26 Nov 1998 21:37:52 +1100 (EST)
From: Paul Graham 
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: aussie-weather: Re: TV Show on Saturday Night
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I wonder if the tornado they show in the promo. occurred in Australia? 
(Australia's Natural Born Killer's, Channel 7, "The World Around Us",
Saturday night)
- Paul G.  
---------------------------- 
Paul Graham
m3052695 at hardy.ocs.mq.edu.au 
----------------------------
On Thu, 26 Nov 1998, McDonald wrote:

> Hi all,
> 
> Thanks to those who helped me get into IRC last night.
> 
> For melbournians - if we happen to get nothing from this next cold front in
> the way of storms there is a program on Saturday night called "Australia's
> Natural Born Killers" on Channel Rex ( 7 ) at 6:30pm.  It may/should have
> some interesting information and footage on storms/cyclones as it goes for
> two hours and I don't think there is two hours of worthwile fire and
> earthquake information to last that long.
> 
> Lightning tracker - I have just sent an email back to these people and will
> hopefully have more soon.
> 
> Andrew McDonald.