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Storm News
[Index][Aussie-Wx] |
Australian Weather Mailing List Archives: Tuesday, 31 August 1999 |
From Subject
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001 Ira Fehlberg [jra at upnaway.com] Mini Tornados & cold air funnels
002 Les Crossan [les.crossan at virgin.net] Storm Chasing vs Fuel
003 Les Crossan [les.crossan at virgin.net] Storm Chasing vs Fuel
004 Les Crossan [les.crossan at virgin.net] Fuijita Wind Scale in Media Reporting...
005 "Patrick Tobin" [patricktobin at ozemail.com.au] Snow + models for later in the week (was Hello??)
006 Les Crossan [les.crossan at virgin.net] Non - tornadic tornadoes
007 Michael Scollay [michael.scollay at telstra.com. MSC update
008 John Woodbridge [jrw at pixelcom.net] Fuijita Wind Scale in Media Reporting...
009 John Woodbridge [jrw at pixelcom.net] Synoptic Circulation of Recent Low...
010 John Woodbridge [jrw at pixelcom.net] Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
011 Blair Trewin [blair at met.Unimelb.EDU.AU] 1961 air crash???
012 Blair Trewin [blair at met.Unimelb.EDU.AU] Hello??
013 Blair Trewin [blair at met.Unimelb.EDU.AU] Some aspects of Australian tornado climatology
014 Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au] Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
015 Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au] Saturdays chase + stupid computer :(
016 Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au] Strahan Weather
017 peter.corlett at doi.vic.gov.au Melbourne Soundings
018 Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au] SE QLD Hailstorms
019 Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au] Melbourne Soundings
020 Michael Scollay [michael.scollay at telstra.com. Hello??
021 John Woodbridge [jrw at pixelcom.net] Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
022 "Michael Thompson" [michaelt at ozemail.com.au] Tornado or downburst
023 "Dane Newman" [dpn at bigpond.com] Kilsyth Weather Summary August 99
024 "Kevin Phyland" [kjphyland at hotmail.com] Interactions
025 Dean S [deansgar at alphalink.com.au] 1900's Ballarat Tornado
026 "Kevin Phyland" [kjphyland at hotmail.com] Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
027 Jimmy Deguara [jdeguara at ihug.com.au] Hello??
028 Keith Barnett [weather at ozemail.com.au] Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
029 Paul Miracki [pmiracki at powerup.com.au] about me
030 Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au] Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
031 Matt Smith [disarm at braenet.com.au] BoM page update
032 "Rod Aikman" [raikman at hotmail.com] 1900's Ballarat Tornado
033 Jimmy Deguara [jdeguara at ihug.com.au] Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" vs lightning damage to house
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001
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Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 11:08:21 +0800
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
From: Ira Fehlberg [jra at upnaway.com]
Subject: RE: aus-wx: Mini Tornados & cold air funnels
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Yep, once any funnel touches down it becomes either a Tornado or
landspout/waterspout.
Ira
At 08:45 30/08/99 +1000, you wrote:
>Hi Ira,
>
>So, are saying is that if a cold air funnel does touch down it then
becomes a tornado by definition?
>
>John.
>
>
>>snip
>
>They are generally referred to as cold air funnels, the word mini seems to
>be associated with any small tornado not just winter types and is an
>incorrect term. Also the term Landspout is defined as tornadoes that form
>in non-supercell/non-severe storms. A Landspout to me is from cloud base to
>ground on a "fair weather" or non-severe day. However the true definition
>of cold air funnels is funnels that form in in cool air behind a frontal
>system associated with thunderless cumulus congestus or cumulonimbus. The
>tornadoes we get here in winter are usually in the storms in the cold pool
>behind the front and whilst they are'nt as electrically active as summer
>they have thunder dont worry about that. They move so fast that the
>activity often seems brief. Ask any Perth resident. So cold air funnels
>seems to me an incorrect term as well. I agree whole-heartedly with what
>Anthony said, its either a tornado or it isnt. Cold air funnels are funnels
>on or in the front that dont touch down.
>
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
>
>
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002
Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 21:04:32 +0100
From: Les Crossan [les.crossan at virgin.net]
Organization: Personal - ICQ 17296776 - note all times in GMT
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To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Storm Chasing vs Fuel
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Anthony Cornelius wrote:
> Hi Les,
> How does this compare to UK prices?
Now having done my sums, about 2/3 as much!!!!
Cheap compared to us on this small isle....
Les
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003
Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 20:46:17 +0100
From: Les Crossan [les.crossan at virgin.net]
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Subject: Re: aus-wx: Storm Chasing vs Fuel
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Anthony Cornelius wrote:
> Hi Les,
>
> Les Crossan wrote:
>
> > BTW, how much is petrol / litre in $AU?????
> A few days ago, it was 72.9c/L
72.9p / litre..... 2 1/2 times more!!!
Les
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004
Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 20:53:20 +0100
From: Les Crossan [les.crossan at virgin.net]
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To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Fuijita Wind Scale in Media Reporting...
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Paul Graham wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> It would be good to see the Fuijita wind scale
Why??? The Fujita scale is an indicator of damage caused, no damage (open
country) = F0. Better for the BoM to adopt the TORRO scale which is a true
measure of windspeed.
Les
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005
From: "Patrick Tobin" [patricktobin at ozemail.com.au]
To: [aussie-weather at world.std.com]
Subject: aus-wx: Snow + models for later in the week (was Hello??)
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 08:16:00 +1000
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Yes thanks for that Paul (welcome by the way)..once temps get much above 7
or 8C, in strong sun, the snow really gets a belting - especially on top of
last weeks rain.
The coming weekend could do some sort of rescue job - although I think that
we have passed the peak snow depths for this season.
There is an interesting discrepancy in the US models for tomorrow's weak
frontal passage passage across SE Aust. Most models (including GASP and the
BOM forecast) suggest that the front will be pretty much a non-event.
NOGAPS has been alone in predicting rain for SE NSW for Wednesday pm and
again Thursday pm. It has been consistent in it's prediction for some days
and as now it is only 48hrs out it will be interesting to see what happens.
A weak frontal passage is often a trigger for storms in summer so again it
will be interesting to see which models are more reliable in differing
synoptic situations.
Patrick (from Canberra)
>From: Michael Thompson
>Subject: Re: aus-wx: Hello??
>Welcome to the list Paul. That sounds dreadful news for the ski buffs, of
>whom we have a couple on the list.
>
>Michael
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Paul Miracki
>To:
>Sent: Monday, 30 August 1999 19:12
>Subject: aus-wx: Hello??
>
>
>> hello? I'm new around here.. Just came to say that Perisher valley had
>> a max of 13�C today, that's 10�C above their August mean. The August
>> record is 14�C for Perisher and the forecast is for 14�C tommorow there.
>> Mt crackenback at around 2000 metres had 9.7�C today and the August
>> record is 10.5�C. The forecast for tommorow there is for 10�C so some
>> records might be broken??.
>>
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006
Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 23:33:47 +0100
From: Les Crossan [les.crossan at virgin.net]
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To: aus-wx [aussie-weather at world.std.com]
Subject: aus-wx: Non - tornadic tornadoes
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dear list -
I seem to cave come into this discussion a little late (weekend away to
Campbeltown, Scotland) but I'll add my international hapenny's worth.
The UK has the same problem with this mini - tornado thing, considering
the UK has had one T8 (F4) (presumably this is a maxi - tornado) in the
last coupla hundred years the Press and the Met Office feel justified in
using this description as well as the dreaded F - word; indeed the UK
was considered non - tornadic until the 1950's or so. However the
general consensus in the UK and certainly within the TORRO membership is
that all tornadoes are just that, it doesn't matter if they are F0 / T1
or F5 or even T10!
I've seen the term "steam devil" used for tornadic activity in Europe...
The term "land devil" is used here for rotating colums of air which
extend upwards from the ground and do not extend from thunderstorm
bases. These babies can make tents disappear...
Deep cold air (single cell / pulse) thunderstorms can occur in warm
humid air without shear, surely Darwin is an example of that, it doesn't
need shear or helicity to produce a tornado the updraught can start
spinning on its own accord or can be set spinning by a downdraught in
the right place - this is a typical UK tornado, the term "rope tornado"
has been used in the UK to describe this kind of event. Does Darwin get
this kind of thing, i've seen enough wall clouds from Darwin storms in
the aus - wx photo archive!
As you all know, mini - tornadoes can cause maxi damage.
As regards "mini - cyclones" a similar misnomer is used for these nasty
areas of low pressure that can brew up in the north Atlantic (usually!)
in wintertime that can have pressure centres of 954 mb, these are
incorrectly called hurricanes, which they arent, even though they can
produce hurricane force winds! However it looks like that we are going
to have a bonanza of nasty extra - tropical storms (can be identified
here as almost entirely circular low pressure areas without fronts) this
year, roll 'em on! Mini - hurricanes, perhaps??? These babies can have
MCS, supercells and tornadoes embedded in their structures mind, there
has been damage recorded in the Uk, France and the Netherlands which may
be caused by tornadic winds from extratropicals.
Fuel to the fire.....
Les
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007
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 09:54:59 +1000
From: Michael Scollay [michael.scollay at telstra.com.au]
Organization: Telstra Strategy & Research
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To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: MSC update
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Jane ONeill wrote:
>
> I've loaded an animation of the IR satellite from 23rd - 29th August at the
> following address. Be warned though, it's my first animation & takes 14
> minutes to load...but worth a look if you have the patience.
> http://www.rubix.net.au/~cadence/augustlow.htm
For those in ASWA, I have a cropped animation of the same event
using gmsd satpics at hourly intervals of about the same size.
The address of this will be sent to committee members once it
is uploaded.
Michael Scollay mailto:michael.scollay at telstra.com.au
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008
From: John Woodbridge [jrw at pixelcom.net]
To: "'aussie-weather at world.std.com'" [aussie-weather at world.std.com]
Subject: RE: aus-wx: Fuijita Wind Scale in Media Reporting...
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 10:16:17 +1000
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Yes but...,
If there is no damage and no doppler radar, how the hell does one estimate the wind speed?
John.
-----Original Message-----
From: Les Crossan [SMTP:les.crossan at virgin.net]
Sent: Tuesday, 31 August 1999 5:53
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Fuijita Wind Scale in Media Reporting...
Paul Graham wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> It would be good to see the Fuijita wind scale
Why??? The Fujita scale is an indicator of damage caused, no damage (open
country) = F0. Better for the BoM to adopt the TORRO scale which is a true
measure of windspeed.
Les
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009
From: John Woodbridge [jrw at pixelcom.net]
To: "'aussie-weather at world.std.com'" [aussie-weather at world.std.com]
Subject: RE: aus-wx: Synoptic Circulation of Recent Low...
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 10:27:01 +1000
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Hi Michael,
I was fascinated by the animated Ch 9 cloud map - from this it looked like
there should have been a deep MSL low as the circulation was very clearly
defined with hurricane like spiral bands. In the absence of that I had
assumed that it must have just been a mid level/upper system. It certainly
was interesting and was responsible for some damage caused by resulting
storms in SE QLD & the Fairfield event. Any soundings from somewhere near
the centre of this system?
John.
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Scollay [SMTP:michael.scollay at telstra.com.au]
Sent: Monday, 30 August 1999 17:50
To: Aussie Weather
Subject: aus-wx: Synoptic Circulation of Recent Low...
The MSL synoptic charts over the last few days fail to agree with
the progress of an inland "low" clearly visible from satpics. While
I was meeting an MSL and gmsd archive request today, I animated the
sequences and to my surprise, the BoM's MSL synoptic charts showed
the "low" disappear into a trough but the gmsd satpics continued
to show a very clear circulation of cloud into a low that moved
from inland Victoria NNE to SE Queensland with circulation finally
stopping when the "low" was centred about SE Qld about 00Z on
29/08/1999 (Sunday). My only explanation is a mid-level low that
failed to show much at the low levels. At all other times that
I have compared synoptic charts to satpics, there has been very
close agreement between circulation patters and MSL pressure
systems. What do others think about this latest event?
Michael Scollay mailto:michael.scollay at telstra.com.au
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010
From: John Woodbridge [jrw at pixelcom.net]
To: "'aussie-weather at world.std.com'" [aussie-weather at world.std.com]
Subject: RE: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 10:36:53 +1000
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Hi John, Anthony,
I would have to extrememly doubt whether a CG stroke could cause this kind
of damage unless it happened to ignite gas cylinders or some such. In the
absence of a tornadic squall, my best suggestion would be ball lightning -
which must have entered the house, possibly through a wall or opening and
then exploded. Such things, while extremely rare and still defying any
scientific explanation, have been documented/observed in the past.
John.
-----Original Message-----
From: John Graham [SMTP:gorzzz at optusnet.com.au]
Sent: Sunday, 29 August 1999 20:21
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights
Thunderstorms
----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Cornelius [cyclone at flatrate.net.au]
To: Australian Weather Mailing List [aussie-weather at world.std.com]
Sent: Sunday, August 29, 1999 5:06 PM
Subject: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
> Hi all,
>
> James told me earlier that rooves were damaged by lightning...but on the
> radio, one house was reportedly "blown apart by lightning" - a dozen
> homes nearby had damage to rooves. Hmmm...this doesn't sound like
> lightning damage to me! But we'll see, hopefully the news will have
> some photos of damage. Apparently, the windows, walls and ceiling have
> been blown out on one home. The SES has commented that it was fortunate
> that no one was in the house at the time.
>
> This occurred at Labrador - Steve, perhaps you can provide more feedback
> on this?
>
> Some Brisbane suburbs were blacked out by the storms last night too.
The house was pretty well stuffed by what I saw on TV tonight........they
said that the TV antenna got hit, but when they showed it, (the antenna),
there was no tell-tale lightning damage (melted ant. elements
etc.)......I'm
wondering if the bolt touched down on a nearby tree & 'bounced" into the
house.
See ya's
John
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011
From: Blair Trewin [blair at met.Unimelb.EDU.AU]
Subject: Re: aus-wx: 1961 air crash???
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 11:30:23 +1000 (EST)
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>
> I investigated the newspaper reports from the time but there was nothing to
> suggest a tornado caused the crash. The aircraft simply disappeared so I'm
> not sure when the tornado theory came into play.
> However, the plane did take off into heavy thunderstorms and I heard
> somewhere that roll clouds were reported, so perhaps this is where it
> originated?
> I know it is officially logged as having been caused by a tornado but I
> don't know where the evidence for this came from..
> - Paul G.
According to Allen, 'during the official inquiry there were eyewitness
accounts of funnel and roll clouds, even though the cause of the
crash was found to be thunderstorm turbulence'.
Blair Trewin
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012
From: Blair Trewin [blair at met.Unimelb.EDU.AU]
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Hello??
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 11:28:25 +1000 (EST)
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>
> hello? I'm new around here.. Just came to say that Perisher valley had
> a max of 13�C today, that's 10�C above their August mean. The August
> record is 14�C for Perisher and the forecast is for 14�C tommorow there.
> Mt crackenback at around 2000 metres had 9.7�C today and the August
> record is 10.5�C. The forecast for tommorow there is for 10�C so some
> records might be broken??.
I wouldn't take the Crackenback or Perisher records at face value, as
the period of observation is fairly short and there is a lot of
missing data. However, Cabramurra, which is a fairly reliable record
with 37 years of data, reached 14 (rounded) yesterday - just below
its August highest of 14.9 (set on 24 August 1995).
This is reasonably representative of conditions on the more exposed
parts of the alpine area. (Although it's less of a factor for maximum
temperature, the microclimates within the alpine region can be
astonishing - daily minimum temperatures at Kiandra in July are better-
correlated with those of Alice Springs than they are with those at
Cabramurra, about 15km away!).
Snow buffs shouldn't despair completely yet - the 1995 warm spell in
August was a precursor to the cold outbreak of 4-5 September,
probably the most extreme of the decade in Victoria (snow fell
briefly in central Melbourne). The ECMWF has a decently strong cold
front on the weekend, GASP less so.
Blair Trewin
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013
From: Blair Trewin [blair at met.Unimelb.EDU.AU]
Subject: aus-wx: Some aspects of Australian tornado climatology
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com (Aussie Weather)
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 11:42:41 +1000 (EST)
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To answer a few questions, I've dug up a copy of Allen's tornado
climatology (this also clarifies a few numbers I was trying to
remember off the top of my head yesterday).
A map is presented for the 1950-59 period giving numbers of tornadoes
per 100,000 sq.km per year. There are VERY sharp peaks around the
major cities except Canberra (not that Canberra was a major city in
the 1950s), reflecting the lack of reporting in the country. The
peak value reaches 8.3 in the Sydney area (also 4.6 in Melbourne,
2.8 in Brisbane, 3.0 in Adelaide, 4.4 in Perth - which was also a
fair bit smaller then than it is now). The only rural area which
reaches 1 is western and central Victoria (which is fairly heavily
settled); otherwise the major belts of occurrence are on and inland from
the Great Dividing Range.
Comparing these numbers to the US, they peak around 35 in Oklahoma.
Most of the Midwest is in the 10-15 range, and most of the eastern
coastal states are between 3 and 7 - which suggests that tornado
frequency in coastal eastern Australia is on a par with that in the
eastern US.
Allen also lists all tornadoes causing deaths in Australia between
1904 and 1976. These are as follows:
Avenel VIC 15/7/1904 (2)
Brighton VIC 2/2/1918 (2)
Tambo QLD 15/1/1922 (1)
Lismore VIC 22/7/1926 (1)
Castle Hill NSW 25/1/1937 (4)
Trangie NSW 30/11/1940 (2) (quoted as '31 Nov' in Allen,
so I'm guessing the date)
Ipswich QLD 12/2/1945 (1)
Tamworth NSW 8/1/1950 (1)
Highbury West WA 19/3/1957 (1)
Glenelg SA 17/7/1958 (1)
Maryborough VIC 31/12/1960 (1)
Sydney Airport NSW 30/11/1961 (15)
Port Macquarie NSW 9/7/1962 (3)
Mt Waverley VIC 11/12/1969 (1)
Wahpunga QLD 14/8/1971 (3)
Sandon VIC 13/11/1976 (2)
I'm not sure exactly what is included as a tornado death (for example,
whether road accidents are included).
Blair Trewin
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-----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
014
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 11:25:22 +1000
From: Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I)
X-Accept-Language: en
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hey John, Anthony, Everyone..
I saw the footage of the house several times over the weekend/on
Monday.. and I am having no trouble accepting the fact that lightning
caused the damage..
The footage showed that every single light fitting and powerpoint in the
house had literally exploded, leaving scorch marks around the
fittings/points and in some cases the fibro/plasterboard or whatever it
was has been removed around the lights/fittings.. The reports of the
house "exploding" is just another case of the media dramatising the
event..
I am no expert on lightning, but i have heard of things like this
happening before..
John Woodbridge wrote:
>
> Hi John, Anthony,
>
> I would have to extrememly doubt whether a CG stroke could cause this kind
> of damage unless it happened to ignite gas cylinders or some such. In the
> absence of a tornadic squall, my best suggestion would be ball lightning -
> which must have entered the house, possibly through a wall or opening and
> then exploded. Such things, while extremely rare and still defying any
> scientific explanation, have been documented/observed in the past.
>
> John.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Graham [SMTP:gorzzz at optusnet.com.au]
> Sent: Sunday, 29 August 1999 20:21
> To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
> Subject: Re: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights
> Thunderstorms
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Anthony Cornelius
> To: Australian Weather Mailing List
> Sent: Sunday, August 29, 1999 5:06 PM
> Subject: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > James told me earlier that rooves were damaged by lightning...but on the
> > radio, one house was reportedly "blown apart by lightning" - a dozen
> > homes nearby had damage to rooves. Hmmm...this doesn't sound like
> > lightning damage to me! But we'll see, hopefully the news will have
> > some photos of damage. Apparently, the windows, walls and ceiling have
> > been blown out on one home. The SES has commented that it was fortunate
> > that no one was in the house at the time.
> >
> > This occurred at Labrador - Steve, perhaps you can provide more feedback
> > on this?
> >
> > Some Brisbane suburbs were blacked out by the storms last night too.
>
> The house was pretty well stuffed by what I saw on TV tonight........they
> said that the TV antenna got hit, but when they showed it, (the antenna),
> there was no tell-tale lightning damage (melted ant. elements
> etc.)......I'm
> wondering if the bolt touched down on a nearby tree & 'bounced" into the
> house.
> See ya's
> John
>
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> To unsubscribe from aussie-weather send e-mail to:majordomo at world.std.com
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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015
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 12:01:01 +1000
From: Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I)
X-Accept-Language: en
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: aus-wx: Saturdays chase + stupid computer :(
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hey Ben from Brisbane here..
I have had computer problems for the past 3-4 days.. so i haven't been
able to access the Internet..
As Anthony mentioned in a previous email, we chased SW of Brisbane
during Saturday.. while at first it was looking very very iffy, once we
cleared the coastal congestus/cloudcover things started to look a little
interesting towards the W and SW.. before we knew it storms were visible
over the ranges, some of which were by no means weak.. with a great
crisp anvil on a storm on the northern edge of the line early in the
afternoon..
It turned out to be a good day, but at the same time a little
frustrating.. as Anthony also mentioned, the storms really didn't want
to move off the ranges so we didn't get to see any base features..
although we did watch the storm Michael Bath was talking about develope
from a weak but reasonably thick anvil stage to a backshearing storm
with boiling updrafts on the ENE side..
It was a nice day for August.. and we definitely have some great
pictures of developing Congestus/Tcu..
Surprisingly enough the thunderstorms continued into Saturday night..
with lightning (up to 10 or so strikes a minute) visible in all
directions but the north here at Redcliffe until i crashed at 11-12pm..
There was also an area of thunderstorms visible SE of Brisbane during
Sunday morning/early Sunday afternoon with the SE horizon looking very
very dark.. no internet access, and of course no tracker or radar was
very frustrating!
John Woodbridge wrote:
>
> Hi John, Anthony,
>
> I would have to extrememly doubt whether a CG stroke could cause this kind
> of damage unless it happened to ignite gas cylinders or some such. In the
> absence of a tornadic squall, my best suggestion would be ball lightning -
> which must have entered the house, possibly through a wall or opening and
> then exploded. Such things, while extremely rare and still defying any
> scientific explanation, have been documented/observed in the past.
>
> John.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Graham [SMTP:gorzzz at optusnet.com.au]
> Sent: Sunday, 29 August 1999 20:21
> To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
> Subject: Re: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights
> Thunderstorms
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Anthony Cornelius
> To: Australian Weather Mailing List
> Sent: Sunday, August 29, 1999 5:06 PM
> Subject: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > James told me earlier that rooves were damaged by lightning...but on the
> > radio, one house was reportedly "blown apart by lightning" - a dozen
> > homes nearby had damage to rooves. Hmmm...this doesn't sound like
> > lightning damage to me! But we'll see, hopefully the news will have
> > some photos of damage. Apparently, the windows, walls and ceiling have
> > been blown out on one home. The SES has commented that it was fortunate
> > that no one was in the house at the time.
> >
> > This occurred at Labrador - Steve, perhaps you can provide more feedback
> > on this?
> >
> > Some Brisbane suburbs were blacked out by the storms last night too.
>
> The house was pretty well stuffed by what I saw on TV tonight........they
> said that the TV antenna got hit, but when they showed it, (the antenna),
> there was no tell-tale lightning damage (melted ant. elements
> etc.)......I'm
> wondering if the bolt touched down on a nearby tree & 'bounced" into the
> house.
> See ya's
> John
>
> +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
> To unsubscribe from aussie-weather send e-mail to:majordomo at world.std.com
> with "unsubscribe aussie-weather your_email_address" in the body of your
> message.
> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
> +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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016
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 12:52:30 +1000
From: Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I)
X-Accept-Language: en
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Strahan Weather
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hey Chas at Helen, Everyone..
Just in case you didn't find the correct URL.. you can just cut back the
URL and get a directory listing.. like this:
http://lumahai.soest.hawaii.edu/gifs/models/GLOBAL/
I have also uploaded some global MSLP animations to the BSCH webspace
for you as well.. These loops plus over 150 more will be available in a
matter of weeks on BSCH.. These loops will be kept in this directory
until BSCH is ready for the web..
>From the University of Hawaii (animations of the charts on the above
URL)..
http://www.bsch.simplenet.com/ben/temploops/globallongrangemrf.htm
George Mueller Global MSLP and 500mb heights animation..
http://www.bsch.simplenet.com/ben/temploops/mslp+500hgtglobal.htm
As far as i know these loops work on all 4+ browsers.. If anyone has any
problems please sing out..
Chas & Helen Osborn wrote:
>
> Hello Everyone
>
> The URL I just posted is the wrong one as that one is out of date!!!!. When I
> find the right one I will let you know.
>
> Chas
> Chas & Helen Osborn wrote:
>
> > Hello Everyone
> >
> > A beautiful day here the sun is shining, a light breeze from the north
> > with a warm temperature of 16C.
> > Thank you to those who helped in my search for a world synoptic weather
> > map. The best I came up with was a world MSL pressure map not exactly
> > what I wanted but it is quick to come up and is good for world hot spots
> > at a glance.
> >
> > http://lumahai.soest.hawaii.edu/gifs/models/GLOBAL/global_sfc_f000.gif
> >
> > To those involved with the snow study I am happy to help with the
> > Tasmania part of it.
> > Chas
> > Strahan Tasmania
> >
> > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
> > To unsubscribe from aussie-weather send e-mail to:majordomo at world.std.com
> > with "unsubscribe aussie-weather your_email_address" in the body of your
> > message.
> > -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
>
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
017
From: peter.corlett at doi.vic.gov.au
X-Lotus-FromDomain: DOI
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 13:05:36 +1000
Subject: aus-wx: Melbourne Soundings
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hi all,
Does anyone know where I can get atmospheric soundings for
Melbourne? I don't seem to be able to get them from the Uni. of Wyoming site.
Cheers,
Pete.
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018
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 13:32:11 +1000
From: Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I)
X-Accept-Language: en
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: aus-wx: SE QLD Hailstorms
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hey, Me again..
Ok, last post from me today..
I have uploaded some lightning tracker images and a large event loop for
Fridays hailstorms in SE QLD.. You can see how slow the storms were
moving west of Brisbane.. and there was red in one cell for over 2
hours!!!! So the reports of 15 inches of hail covering a highway are
very much possible..
The event loop starts at around 12:20pm and finishes at around 11pm or
so (from memory)..
The Lightning Tracker images..
http://www.bsch.simplenet.com/27-08-99/tracker.htm
The event loop
http://www.bsch.simplenet.com/27-08-99/eventloop.gif
I will also make up an event loop + tracker page for Saturdays storms
when i get the time..
Ben Quinn wrote:
>
> Hey Ben from Brisbane here..
>
> I have had computer problems for the past 3-4 days.. so i haven't been
> able to access the Internet..
>
> As Anthony mentioned in a previous email, we chased SW of Brisbane
> during Saturday.. while at first it was looking very very iffy, once we
> cleared the coastal congestus/cloudcover things started to look a little
> interesting towards the W and SW.. before we knew it storms were visible
> over the ranges, some of which were by no means weak.. with a great
> crisp anvil on a storm on the northern edge of the line early in the
> afternoon..
>
> It turned out to be a good day, but at the same time a little
> frustrating.. as Anthony also mentioned, the storms really didn't want
> to move off the ranges so we didn't get to see any base features..
> although we did watch the storm Michael Bath was talking about develope
> from a weak but reasonably thick anvil stage to a backshearing storm
> with boiling updrafts on the ENE side..
>
> It was a nice day for August.. and we definitely have some great
> pictures of developing Congestus/Tcu..
>
> Surprisingly enough the thunderstorms continued into Saturday night..
> with lightning (up to 10 or so strikes a minute) visible in all
> directions but the north here at Redcliffe until i crashed at 11-12pm..
>
> There was also an area of thunderstorms visible SE of Brisbane during
> Sunday morning/early Sunday afternoon with the SE horizon looking very
> very dark.. no internet access, and of course no tracker or radar was
> very frustrating!
>
> John Woodbridge wrote:
> >
> > Hi John, Anthony,
> >
> > I would have to extrememly doubt whether a CG stroke could cause this kind
> > of damage unless it happened to ignite gas cylinders or some such. In the
> > absence of a tornadic squall, my best suggestion would be ball lightning -
> > which must have entered the house, possibly through a wall or opening and
> > then exploded. Such things, while extremely rare and still defying any
> > scientific explanation, have been documented/observed in the past.
> >
> > John.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: John Graham [SMTP:gorzzz at optusnet.com.au]
> > Sent: Sunday, 29 August 1999 20:21
> > To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
> > Subject: Re: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights
> > Thunderstorms
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Anthony Cornelius
> > To: Australian Weather Mailing List
> > Sent: Sunday, August 29, 1999 5:06 PM
> > Subject: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
> >
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > James told me earlier that rooves were damaged by lightning...but on the
> > > radio, one house was reportedly "blown apart by lightning" - a dozen
> > > homes nearby had damage to rooves. Hmmm...this doesn't sound like
> > > lightning damage to me! But we'll see, hopefully the news will have
> > > some photos of damage. Apparently, the windows, walls and ceiling have
> > > been blown out on one home. The SES has commented that it was fortunate
> > > that no one was in the house at the time.
> > >
> > > This occurred at Labrador - Steve, perhaps you can provide more feedback
> > > on this?
> > >
> > > Some Brisbane suburbs were blacked out by the storms last night too.
> >
> > The house was pretty well stuffed by what I saw on TV tonight........they
> > said that the TV antenna got hit, but when they showed it, (the antenna),
> > there was no tell-tale lightning damage (melted ant. elements
> > etc.)......I'm
> > wondering if the bolt touched down on a nearby tree & 'bounced" into the
> > house.
> > See ya's
> > John
> >
> > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
> > To unsubscribe from aussie-weather send e-mail to:majordomo at world.std.com
> > with "unsubscribe aussie-weather your_email_address" in the body of your
> > message.
> > -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
> > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
> > To unsubscribe from aussie-weather send e-mail to:majordomo at world.std.com
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> > message.
> > -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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019
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 14:10:11 +1000
From: Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I)
X-Accept-Language: en
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Melbourne Soundings
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hey Peter, Ben here..
Ok, this is definitely my last post for the day..
You can get Atmospheric Soundings from 'The Storm Machine"
http://www.stormchaser.niu.edu/machine/
Just put in the station ID for Melbourne..
I can't help myself.. and email about Atmospheric Soundings just isn't
right without a plug for my soundings page
http://www.nemas.net/edu/soundings/soundings.htm
What the hell.. I'll give Anthony's Skew-T page a plug as well..
http://www.nemas.net/edu/skewt/skewt.html
peter.corlett at doi.vic.gov.au wrote:
>
> Hi all,
> Does anyone know where I can get atmospheric soundings for
> Melbourne? I don't seem to be able to get them from the Uni. of Wyoming site.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Pete.
>
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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020
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 14:37:32 +1000
From: Michael Scollay [michael.scollay at telstra.com.au]
Organization: Telstra Strategy & Research
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4m)
X-Accept-Language: en
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Hello??
X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by europe.std.com id AAA11261
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
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Michael Thompson wrote on Mon, 30 Aug 1999 22:32:30 +1000:
>
> Welcome to the list Paul. That sounds dreadful news for the ski buffs,
> of whom we have a couple on the list.
>
> Michael
>
> Paul Miracki wrote on Monday, 30 August 1999 19:12
>
> > hello? I'm new around here.. Just came to say that Perisher valley
> > had a max of 13�C today, that's 10�C above their August mean. The
> > August record is 14�C for Perisher and the forecast is for 14�C
> > tommorow there. Mt crackenback at around 2000 metres had 9.7�C today
> > and the August record is 10.5�C. The forecast for tommorow there is
> > for 10�C so some records might be broken??.
Welcome Paul from a depressed snow/ski buff. Fortunately, I went
to Perisher and skied while the snow and weather was superb! That
was only 14-21/08/1999.
In my thrice-weekly "wx-fax" that I send to our ski lodge in
Perisher derived from the AVN model, I expected a max of 9/10
but not 13!. Our lodge only reached a max of 9, which is the
highest lodge in Australia being just under 1800m and above
the Sundeck. I would expect that calm conditions and the
proximity of dark buildings near to the PV obs site had
something to do with this localised anomaly. Blair?
Nevertheless, as Patrick points out, these temps do wonderful
things to turn snow into water and water vapour:-( Something
similar happened last year from 28/8 as the temps climbed
well above freezing and stayed there until 05/09. From 09/09,
temps were back to well above freezing until 15/09. Some
snow fell in the gaps then after the 3rd week of September,
the 1998 season ended early. However, snow did return in the
second week of October 1998.
Historically, since 1962, the max snow depth at Spencers
Creek averages during W3 of August. There are some notable
exceptions to this with much later snow depth maximums. In
particular, 1962, 1968, 1970, 1971, 1980, 1989, 1991, 1992,
1994 and 1996. None of which where "poor" years from the
average snow depth perspective. Interesting to note that
there has been a loss of snow at this time with a recovery
during mid to late September and October from 1962 to 1969,
1977, 1979, 1987, 1991, 1994-1996 and even a slight recovery
in 1998. It is actually hard to find an exception to this,
but it is prudent to point out that a "recovery" of the
snow depth during September is becoming less frequent since
1996.
Thus, it seems that the 1999 is getting a warm-bashing also,
but one week earlier than 1998! Looking back, 1969, 1979 and
1995 were similar and not at any extreme of the El Nino - La
Nina scale (SOI). 1999 which is bordering on a mild La Nina.
Interesting that 1989 was also a lousy year, but with much
stronger La Nina conditions. Is there a ten-year cycle here?
So I would expect that conditions might have been similar re:
the passage and position of weather systems caused largely
by the nature of SST's around Australia and in the oceans
immediately adjacent (see BoM EOF Model). This doesn't alter
radically during the following spring/ early summer so we
can expect a little recovery of snow in September but an
otherwise, an early end to the snow season, again. This is
becoming depressingly frequent in recent years:-(
Looking 0-288hrs ahead, MRF has a decent cold front on Sat
04/09 with most precip falling before the cold air arrives.
Another cold front on 10/09 also, though weaker, again with
most precip before the front falling warm conditions. Time
will tell but I'm not jumping for joy with forecasts of new
snow as I don't expect to see very much out of either event.
This year, MRF's forecasts that far ahead have largely
failed to eventuate in anything like the strength initially
anticipated. Blair is likely to comment about the other
models.
Michael Scollay mailto:michael.scollay at telstra.com.au
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021
From: John Woodbridge [jrw at pixelcom.net]
To: "'aussie-weather at world.std.com'" [aussie-weather at world.std.com]
Subject: RE: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 16:29:21 +1000
Organization: Pixel Components
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hi Ben,
Is that a fact! One has to wonder how this could happen, so more wild
speculation.... Maybe the lightning hit the Active side of the mains
somewhere in the house (which may have been switched off at the meter box
as the folks were away on holiday) and simultaneously arc'd to
neutral/ground at every air gap (i.e., power points, light fittings, meter
box) - the air gaps offering a lower breakdown strength than the insulated
conductors themselves. While such a spectacular feat would be no trouble
for a charge which has just broken down several km of free air, you would
think that a single breakdown point would have sufficed. Presumably much
of the conductors themselves were explosively vaporised once several
hundred thousand amperes of current got going, and maybe this caused the
whole thing to actually pass rapidly from point to point - all in a few
nanoseconds.
Imagine being in the house when this happened! (You'd have to get the couch
you were sitting on laundered).
Moreover, if this is what happened, it might not be such an uncommon
possibility, leading me to the thought that one really should put up a nice
thick well earthed lightning conductor. The highest point on my house,
located on a ridge top, is the TV antenna (at 9m above ground) and while I
always yank the VCR connection out of the wall socket everytime a storm
appears, I have often wondered how ineffective introducing a few inches of
air gap in this way really would be.
John.
>snip
The footage showed that every single light fitting and powerpoint in the
house had literally exploded, leaving scorch marks around the
fittings/points and in some cases the fibro/plasterboard or whatever it
was has been removed around the lights/fittings.. The reports of the
house "exploding" is just another case of the media dramatising the
event..
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022
From: "Michael Thompson" [michaelt at ozemail.com.au]
To: [aussie-weather at world.std.com]
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Tornado or downburst
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 17:34:20 +1000
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211
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Yes, you are probably right about more than 1000 ft, but I am thinking of
the speed at which these congestus cells just popped and down. You had cells
going from nothing to pink in 1-2 frames then back to nothing in the next.
Michael
> If you look at the AVN shear maps, if it was a tornado, it certainly
> wasn't either supercellular, or a "coldie." Shear did not get above
> 30kn until you hit 400mb (from memory), not to mention the winds didn't
> back with height, they were ESE on the surface, and only ever got around
> to the NE. The low level shear was also very low (15kn from memory) -
> "coldies" generally need strong low level shear, of which this was
> absent. I have to agree with you, there had to be some dry air
> somewhere, but maybe higher than 1000 feet.
>
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023
From: "Dane Newman" [dpn at bigpond.com]
To: [aussie-weather at world.std.com]
Subject: aus-wx: Kilsyth Weather Summary August 99
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 17:47:31 +1000
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Hi all, here is my weather summary for Kilsyth (Melbourne) For August.
Ave Max 15.3c (14.6c)
Ave Min 7.4c (6.9c)
Warmest day 21.8c (31st)
Coldest day 11.9c ( 16th)
Coldest night 1.7c (3rd)
Rainfall 96.0mm (79.9mm)
Days of Thunder 0 (0.8)
Days of Hail 0
Days of Fog 1
Winter Rain 220.8 (262.0) . All observations are my own, long term averages and dates in brackets. Dane Newman.
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024
X-Originating-IP: [203.25.186.108]
From: "Kevin Phyland" [kjphyland at hotmail.com]
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: aus-wx: Interactions
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 18:34:45 EST
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
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Hi every1,
Gee...I've never been really comfortable with this "separation" of surface,
mid-level and upper-level systems (arbitrary though they are). Surely each
have an influence on the others...and until we figure out just HOW they
influence each other we'll be putting together three different jigsaws
instead of just one....
Any thoughts?
Kevin from Wycheproof.
>From: Don White
>Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
>To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
>Subject: Re: aus-wx: Synoptic Circulation of Recent Low...
>Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 21:36:31 +1000
>
>Michael,
>There's no reason why the MSL pattern has to reflect the moisture
>availability and circulation at mid levels.
>Don W
>
>Michael Scollay wrote:
> >
> > The MSL synoptic charts over the last few days fail to agree with
> > the progress of an inland "low" clearly visible from satpics. While
> > I was meeting an MSL and gmsd archive request today, I animated the
> > sequences and to my surprise, the BoM's MSL synoptic charts showed
> > the "low" disappear into a trough but the gmsd satpics continued
> > to show a very clear circulation of cloud into a low that moved
> > from inland Victoria NNE to SE Queensland with circulation finally
> > stopping when the "low" was centred about SE Qld about 00Z on
> > 29/08/1999 (Sunday). My only explanation is a mid-level low that
> > failed to show much at the low levels. At all other times that
> > I have compared synoptic charts to satpics, there has been very
> > close agreement between circulation patters and MSL pressure
> > systems. What do others think about this latest event?
> >
> > Michael Scollay mailto:michael.scollay at telstra.com.au
> > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
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025
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 18:50:26 +1100
From: Dean S [deansgar at alphalink.com.au]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Win95; I)
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: aus-wx: 1900's Ballarat Tornado
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
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Hi all. Deano here. This is going way back before any of us were alive
or even thought of but I have briefly viewed a newspaper article
while I was sifting through the dusty old newspaper clippings in the
bureas archives about a tornado incident in the early 1900's. I was
wondering if anyone had any available information on this particular
severe storm event. Supposedly, it caused a lot of damage. Thankyou for
your time.
Dean T Sgarbossa
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026
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From: "Kevin Phyland" [kjphyland at hotmail.com]
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: RE: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 18:52:46 EST
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
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Hi every1,
No offense to anyone else's theory...but here's another one!
Suppose the heavy rain had leaked into the roof structure (insulation etc)
and then the lightning flash-heated the water and wooden structures
beneath....would that not have caused explosive expansion as happens with
sap in trees etc...
Just a thought....
Kevin from Wycheproof.
>From: John Woodbridge
>Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
>To: "'aussie-weather at world.std.com'"
>Subject: RE: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights
>Thunderstorms
>Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 10:36:53 +1000
>
>Hi John, Anthony,
>
>I would have to extrememly doubt whether a CG stroke could cause this kind
>of damage unless it happened to ignite gas cylinders or some such. In the
>absence of a tornadic squall, my best suggestion would be ball lightning -
>which must have entered the house, possibly through a wall or opening and
>then exploded. Such things, while extremely rare and still defying any
>scientific explanation, have been documented/observed in the past.
>
>John.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: John Graham [SMTP:gorzzz at optusnet.com.au]
>Sent: Sunday, 29 August 1999 20:21
>To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
>Subject: Re: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights
>Thunderstorms
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Anthony Cornelius
>To: Australian Weather Mailing List
>Sent: Sunday, August 29, 1999 5:06 PM
>Subject: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
>
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > James told me earlier that rooves were damaged by lightning...but on the
> > radio, one house was reportedly "blown apart by lightning" - a dozen
> > homes nearby had damage to rooves. Hmmm...this doesn't sound like
> > lightning damage to me! But we'll see, hopefully the news will have
> > some photos of damage. Apparently, the windows, walls and ceiling have
> > been blown out on one home. The SES has commented that it was fortunate
> > that no one was in the house at the time.
> >
> > This occurred at Labrador - Steve, perhaps you can provide more feedback
> > on this?
> >
> > Some Brisbane suburbs were blacked out by the storms last night too.
>
>The house was pretty well stuffed by what I saw on TV tonight........they
>said that the TV antenna got hit, but when they showed it, (the antenna),
>there was no tell-tale lightning damage (melted ant. elements
>etc.)......I'm
>wondering if the bolt touched down on a nearby tree & 'bounced" into the
>house.
>See ya's
>John
>
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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027
X-Sender: jdeguara at pop.ihug.com.au
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Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 19:59:13 +1000
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
From: Jimmy Deguara [jdeguara at ihug.com.au]
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Hello??
X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by europe.std.com id GAA11530
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Hi Paul,
Jimmy Deguara here. Great to hear from you and I hope you enjoy the list.
Tel the list a little more about yourself: what you do, how you got into
the weather interest and what is your favourite type of weather you like to
experience. Thanks but we like to know these things.
Jimmy Deguara
At 19:12 30/08/99 +1000, you wrote:
> hello? I'm new around here.. Just came to say that Perisher valley had
>a max of 13�C today, that's 10�C above their August mean. The August
>record is 14�C for Perisher and the forecast is for 14�C tommorow there.
>Mt crackenback at around 2000 metres had 9.7�C today and the August
>record is 10.5�C. The forecast for tommorow there is for 10�C so some
>records might be broken??.
>
>
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028
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 20:12:30 +1000
From: Keith Barnett [weather at ozemail.com.au]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en] (Win95; I)
X-Accept-Language: en
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
This event brings back memories of what happened to me in the January
16, 1991 Sydney storm when lightning hit my UHF aerial which, because I
had gotten away with it for several years, was still plugged into the
radio. Although it caused $13000 worth of damage to the anemometer, VCR,
radio power supply, radio, hi-fi equipment and TV, there was nothing of
the order of the Queensland event damage referred to.
The tower to which the aerial is attached, is earthed out via a 1/4 inch
thick electrical cable clamped to a copper rod buried in the ground to a
depth of 6 feet.
Now, of course, I leave the aerial disconnected except when using it, as
well as the VCR/TV.....
How I escaped worse damage, ie a house fire, I'll never know....
John Woodbridge wrote:
>
> Hi Ben,
>
> Is that a fact! One has to wonder how this could happen, so more wild
> speculation.... Maybe the lightning hit the Active side of the mains
> somewhere in the house (which may have been switched off at the meter box
> as the folks were away on holiday) and simultaneously arc'd to
> neutral/ground at every air gap (i.e., power points, light fittings, meter
> box) - the air gaps offering a lower breakdown strength than the insulated
> conductors themselves. While such a spectacular feat would be no trouble
> for a charge which has just broken down several km of free air, you would
> think that a single breakdown point would have sufficed. Presumably much
> of the conductors themselves were explosively vaporised once several
> hundred thousand amperes of current got going, and maybe this caused the
> whole thing to actually pass rapidly from point to point - all in a few
> nanoseconds.
>
> Imagine being in the house when this happened! (You'd have to get the couch
> you were sitting on laundered).
>
> Moreover, if this is what happened, it might not be such an uncommon
> possibility, leading me to the thought that one really should put up a nice
> thick well earthed lightning conductor. The highest point on my house,
> located on a ridge top, is the TV antenna (at 9m above ground) and while I
> always yank the VCR connection out of the wall socket everytime a storm
> appears, I have often wondered how ineffective introducing a few inches of
> air gap in this way really would be.
>
> John.
>
> >snip
> The footage showed that every single light fitting and powerpoint in the
> house had literally exploded, leaving scorch marks around the
> fittings/points and in some cases the fibro/plasterboard or whatever it
> was has been removed around the lights/fittings.. The reports of the
> house "exploding" is just another case of the media dramatising the
> event..
>
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> -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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029
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 20:56:07 +1000
From: Paul Miracki [pmiracki at powerup.com.au]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I)
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: aus-wx: about me
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hi everyone
Here's a little about me for those interested. I live in Brisbane, south
of the city. I was born in Poland and my favourite type of weather is
Cold weather. Snow etc. But some nice thunderstorms are ok :) I have
always been interested in the weather, i think.. since I can remember
anyway. That's all I can think of right now.
By the way, I'm 16 years old :)
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030
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 20:39:10 +1000
From: Ben Quinn [bodie at flatrate.net.au]
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I)
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To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hey Kevin, Everyone (Ok, this is DEFINITELY my last post for the day)..
In the news report it was stated that the house received major water
damage.. whether this was from water leaking in after the lightning
struck the house of if water was already leaking into the house and this
helped conduct the electricity when the lightning struck as kevin has
already said, I don't know..
A few years ago (5 or 6 now), a tree in my next-door neighbours house
was stuck by lightning.. It had been raining heavily for a few days
before the tree was struck, and the tree literally EXPLODED.. there was
not a piece of that tree left bigger than 2cm square.. and it was not
just the trunk of the tree.. even the roots were totally destroyed.. I
can't remember who told us this, but apparently because it had been
raining so heavy for so long.. the tree was very very moist/wet.. and
when the lightning struck the tree this helped conduct the electricity..
and the rest.. well I think a simple way to put it is "BOOOOOM!!" :)
Just something i though might interesting people..
Kevin Phyland wrote:
>
> Hi every1,
>
> No offense to anyone else's theory...but here's another one!
>
> Suppose the heavy rain had leaked into the roof structure (insulation etc)
> and then the lightning flash-heated the water and wooden structures
> beneath....would that not have caused explosive expansion as happens with
> sap in trees etc...
>
> Just a thought....
>
> Kevin from Wycheproof.
>
> >From: John Woodbridge
> >Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
> >To: "'aussie-weather at world.std.com'"
> >Subject: RE: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights
> >Thunderstorms
> >Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 10:36:53 +1000
> >
> >Hi John, Anthony,
> >
> >I would have to extrememly doubt whether a CG stroke could cause this kind
> >of damage unless it happened to ignite gas cylinders or some such. In the
> >absence of a tornadic squall, my best suggestion would be ball lightning -
> >which must have entered the house, possibly through a wall or opening and
> >then exploded. Such things, while extremely rare and still defying any
> >scientific explanation, have been documented/observed in the past.
> >
> >John.
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: John Graham [SMTP:gorzzz at optusnet.com.au]
> >Sent: Sunday, 29 August 1999 20:21
> >To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
> >Subject: Re: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights
> >Thunderstorms
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: Anthony Cornelius
> >To: Australian Weather Mailing List
> >Sent: Sunday, August 29, 1999 5:06 PM
> >Subject: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" by last nights Thunderstorms
> >
> >
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > James told me earlier that rooves were damaged by lightning...but on the
> > > radio, one house was reportedly "blown apart by lightning" - a dozen
> > > homes nearby had damage to rooves. Hmmm...this doesn't sound like
> > > lightning damage to me! But we'll see, hopefully the news will have
> > > some photos of damage. Apparently, the windows, walls and ceiling have
> > > been blown out on one home. The SES has commented that it was fortunate
> > > that no one was in the house at the time.
> > >
> > > This occurred at Labrador - Steve, perhaps you can provide more feedback
> > > on this?
> > >
> > > Some Brisbane suburbs were blacked out by the storms last night too.
> >
> >The house was pretty well stuffed by what I saw on TV tonight........they
> >said that the TV antenna got hit, but when they showed it, (the antenna),
> >there was no tell-tale lightning damage (melted ant. elements
> >etc.)......I'm
> >wondering if the bolt touched down on a nearby tree & 'bounced" into the
> >house.
> >See ya's
> >John
> >
> > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
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> > message.
> > -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
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> > -----------------------jacob at iinet.net.au------------------------------
>
> ______________________________________________________
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031
X-Sender: disarm at braenet.com.au (Unverified)
X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32)
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 21:30:28 +1000
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
From: Matt Smith [disarm at braenet.com.au]
Subject: aus-wx: BoM page update
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hi
The BoM have updated the "Olympic" section of there site, with some nice
things freely available, including colour 4 day MSLP maps, and a few
limited time only things such as Lightning Detection in the Sydney met
area. (i think it might be updated hourly), also some models are available.
A password is required and this is given freely until October 3 this year.
The link is below
http://www.bom.gov.au/olympic/
Matthew Smith
ASWA Committee Member
---------- Storm Reports and Photos ---------
------ http://www.braenet.com.au/~disarm -----
--- Australian Severe Weather Assocciation ---
------- http://www.severeweather.asn.au ------
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032
X-Originating-IP: [203.27.197.19]
From: "Rod Aikman" [raikman at hotmail.com]
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Subject: Re: aus-wx: 1900's Ballarat Tornado
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 21:50:49 EST
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Hi Dean,
Yes there was an outbreak of tornadoes over South-east Australia on
November 14, 1901, including the one you mentioned at Ballarat. (It actually
tore through the district known as Sulky Gully, between Ballarat and
Creswick) There was also a tornado at Castlemaine at the same time, which
resulted in the loss of two lives. A further life was lost at Bacchus Marsh.
Have more details, which I can bring to the meeting on Saturday.
Rod Aikman,
Bendigo
Hi all. Deano here. This is going way back before any of us were alive
or even thought of but I have briefly viewed a newspaper article
while I was sifting through the dusty old newspaper clippings in the
bureas archives about a tornado incident in the early 1900's. I was
wondering if anyone had any available information on this particular
severe storm event. Supposedly, it caused a lot of damage. Thankyou for
your time.
Dean T Sgarbossa
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033
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Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 21:52:56 +1000
To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
From: Jimmy Deguara [jdeguara at ihug.com.au]
Subject: aus-wx: Gold Coast Home "Blown Apart" vs lightning damage to house
at Wyee NSW
Sender: aussie-weather-approval at world.std.com
Reply-To: aussie-weather at world.std.com
Ok my turn re lightning damage.
I can say at first hand that my parents have a farm located at Wyee which
was damaged one time from a lightning strike.
In August 1992, there was a dry day when although thunderstorms developed.
One of the storms came through undetected at Wyee by the locals (we weren't
there). Well, this storm produced a powerful lightning that left in its
wake a series of destruction. First, all windows on one side was shattered
facing the sonic boom created by the lightning (thunder). Every power point
was damaged completely and set on fire. Every electrical appliance was
damaged or burnt even though the main power was switched off at the fuse
box. By the way the fuse box lid which was locked with a pad lock was blown
off completely. The underground wiring leading to a pump of the small dam
was destroyed and the soil along the this wire was lifted to reveal its
location. Some of the fibro were cracked and the nails loosened and in some
cases has burn marks near them I think on the currugated iron sheets. The
PVC sewerage pipe we found a year or so later was shattered. A piece of
tile near the tap exploded into the air bouncing off the celing and then
onto the wall on the other side damaging a painting...
A tree near the house which may have been struck went brown but recovered a
month or so later. For months after the event, locals complained of not
being able to earth electrical fences... The telephone wire along the whole
road had to replaced. Yes, the transformer on the pole out on the road was
also damaged or destroyed.
To sum it all up, the electrical authority and electricians said they had
never seen this much damage in the many years dealing with their job!!!
Michael Bath has seen the damaged switches etc... I may bring it along to a
meeting some time.
Now had the people living in the other house (which was also damaged) not
acted quickly, the house would have caught on fire as well as the
electrical switched were on fire near the carpet...
By the way, people in the town 2 km away shit themselves with the sound of
the loud thunder...
Jimmy Deguara
At 20:12 31/08/99 +1000, you wrote:
>This event brings back memories of what happened to me in the January
>16, 1991 Sydney storm when lightning hit my UHF aerial which, because I
>had gotten away with it for several years, was still plugged into the
>radio. Although it caused $13000 worth of damage to the anemometer, VCR,
>radio power supply, radio, hi-fi equipment and TV, there was nothing of
>the order of the Queensland event damage referred to.
>The tower to which the aerial is attached, is earthed out via a 1/4 inch
>thick electrical cable clamped to a copper rod buried in the ground to a
>depth of 6 feet.
>Now, of course, I leave the aerial disconnected except when using it, as
>well as the VCR/TV.....
>How I escaped worse damage, ie a house fire, I'll never know....
>
>
>John Woodbridge wrote:
> >
> > Hi Ben,
> >
> > Is that a fact! One has to wonder how this could happen, so more wild
> > speculation.... Maybe the lightning hit the Active side of the mains
> > somewhere in the house (which may have been switched off at the meter box
> > as the folks were away on holiday) and simultaneously arc'd to
> > neutral/ground at every air gap (i.e., power points, light fittings, meter
> > box) - the air gaps offering a lower breakdown strength than the insulated
> > conductors themselves. While such a spectacular feat would be no trouble
> > for a charge which has just broken down several km of free air, you would
> > think that a single breakdown point would have sufficed. Presumably much
> > of the conductors themselves were explosively vaporised once several
> > hundred thousand amperes of current got going, and maybe this caused the
> > whole thing to actually pass rapidly from point to point - all in a few
> > nanoseconds.
> >
> > Imagine being in the house when this happened! (You'd have to get the couch
> > you were sitting on laundered).
> >
> > Moreover, if this is what happened, it might not be such an uncommon
> > possibility, leading me to the thought that one really should put up a nice
> > thick well earthed lightning conductor. The highest point on my house,
> > located on a ridge top, is the TV antenna (at 9m above ground) and while I
> > always yank the VCR connection out of the wall socket everytime a storm
> > appears, I have often wondered how ineffective introducing a few inches of
> > air gap in this way really would be.
> >
> > John.
> >
> > >snip
> > The footage showed that every single light fitting and powerpoint in the
> > house had literally exploded, leaving scorch marks around the
> > fittings/points and in some cases the fibro/plasterboard or whatever it
> > was has been removed around the lights/fittings.. The reports of the
> > house "exploding" is just another case of the media dramatising the
> > event..
> >
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| Document: 990831.htm
Updated: 09 September 1999 |
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